"Taxes are never levied for the benefit of the taxed". Robert A. Heinlein.

Damn smart man.

Mark

Damn.

I haven't even done last years taxes. And of course those damn feds keep sending me notices (what a waste of paper, plus it contributes to the landfills - hey Al).

BTW, don't submit your taxes electronically. It makes it a sure thing that they will run it through their computers to pick up inconsistencies.

My cousin used to be a head honcho in the IRS and bailed me big one time.

I think I'll submit 05 before 06. Wonder how that would go over.

I thought I would be a little richer this year but by the time I pay taxes it appears that I will stay with about the same amount of buying power as last year. But I tell you it gripes my butt to have to pay taxes on social security..my gotdam money that I paid in off the fucking top..most of it at the self employment rate.

The only equitable tax is a user/consumer tax. If one doesn't want to pay the taxes then don't use and consume

Change election day to April 15 and lynch the losers ... people who run would have to be dead serious about the job. Call it Death and Taxes Day or something. Of course, we all get a holiday and a long weekend ....

How can you guys bitch about taxes when they are going to the fighting men and women of the armed services? I'm very proud that the taxes I pay go to those who keep me free. And before you all get your panties in a bunch, yes I served. Special forces in Grenada.

Duke: If more of my taxes went to military spending (a legitimate function of government) and less to other government "services", I would pay without complaint.

I am hoping we get our refund (overwitheld taxes) back soon enough to pay our property taxes, which went up 30% in one year (I kid you not)! Kind of hard NOT to bitch when you have to scramble to cover an increase like that on short notice.

I have reached a point in my income earning bracket that it does me no good to try to increase the amount of money I make. As soon as I do, it "dramatically" increases the amount of taxes I have to pay as I head into the next tax bracket. So much for the motivation to do better. Thanks to Uncle Sam, he sees to it once we get to a certain point, unless we dramatically increase our income, there's no motivation to pursue more money (I guess that's an evil liberal clause stuck into the tax code to discourage the disparity between income earners huh?), and as Peggy U mentioned a VERY small amount of our tax dollars goes to the military compared to some crack hoar in the ghetto that has 16 kids and don't know the father of one of them. There would be a significant reduction in our tax burden if we could just obliterate all the special interest programs and require people pay the prices for their bad decisions rather than us hard working, income earners paying it for them.

Election Day on April 15 is a good idea.

If not that, how about we at least require all Congress Critters and Administration 'leaders' to fill out their own tax returns - with no CPA or other professional assistance. These folks are all college-educated and supposedly smart folks - how hard could it be for them to fill out a few simple little IRS forms?

Do you know what's really funny about the bloodsucker Feds? The military gets paid with tax money, but we also get our checks taxed. So they essentially tax taxes. It's so rediculous. Whatever happened to taxation without representation? I'm with GUYK in that we should haver a user/consumer tax. Then all these damn illegals that are putting a strain on our economy with their Federal aid and unpaid hospital visits would have to pay taxes too.

Having taxes withheld rather than being paid in directly by the taxpayers was a "temporary" measure during WWII to help fund the war. But, it's like the excise tax on telephones that was put in to fund the Spanish-American War and has just now been taken away because of a taxpayer lawsuit. With taxes, the only thing temporary are cuts.

Withholding taxes seem to be nothing more than an interest free loan to the government. Since when, ah sheesh, nebber mind.

Duke - Dude! I'm with Peggy. I have no problem with funding the military, which is one of the few gummint programs that is actually in the Constitution. I do have a problem with supporting multigenerational parasites and losers with my hard earned money. 90% of the people who are poor are that way for a reason. They made poor choices. On the other hand, I have no problem helping out those who are poor due to sumpin' beyond their control, such as an accident or catastrophic illness. As I pointed out earlier, we now spend more on social programs than we do on the military as I pointed out here

It's seems a majority of your fellow citizens say the federal government should guarantee health insurance to every American.

What's your opinion on this issue ?

Well, first of all it's a New York Times article. Any information contained there in is suspect. They have a history of ignoring what we in the real world like to call facts. But let's suppose for a moment their poll is accurate. I say that makes for a sad state of affairs as wellfare and social security have been dismal failures. Socialist programs just don't work. If you make a standard government insurance that lacks any real competition then you get substandard doctors. This can often be more tragic than not going to the doctor at all.

This is why Capitalism is a superior form of economics. People who want to make more money and be successful have a high degree of competition. That competition drives their desire for excellence. Hard work = more money so people try harder to be the best in their fields. Socialist programs eliminate any need for competition and only offers a flat (and not too high) rate of income. Why compete or try to do your best when you make just as much as the loser who makes no effort whatsoever?

Sadly the liberal propaganda is taking it's foothold on our youth (a socialist agenda) and I would be willing to bet these kids are the ones they polled. Socializing medicine can only be more tragic to our healthcare system. A better idea would be for these goons to get off of their lazy asses and get a job, particularly one that offers insurance. They should also go to school so they can get good jobs. Even better, they should take care of their bodies and lose this mentality that everything is a sickness and some pill is gonna make it all better. Too many medicine heads in this country. Personally I don't care to have insurance because I rarely get sick (I take care of myself) but only have it for emergencies and for my wife who is anemic.

I'm not rich. I am middle class and my tax base takes the hardest hit. Percentage wise the rich pay more (and I think thats BS too) but it's the middle class that really shoulders these heavy taxes and personally I'm sick of paying them for BS socialist programs that are ineffective and produce nothing but more dependancy on our government. Fact of the matter is it is we who are responsible for our own lives, not the government. The government's responsibility is to allow us the freedom to pursue our own economic course. I was homeless, substance dependant, bounced between jobs, and one foot in the grave and though I am not wealthy I now have a great life because I got off my bottom feeding ass and worked for it. Now I own a house that I rent out, I live in a beautiful and fairly large apartment, I own (fully paid for) two new cars, and have begun ample investments for my retirement so I can be government independant when I am kickin' it in retirement. SS pays shit, I can't expect government run healthcare to be any better.

Prosper......

National Health Insurance!..... A bad Idea but probably will come to pass as the Average American does not have a clue of just how expensive government welfare programs are. Some prominent examples follow;

1. When Johnson ran for President he wanted a one billion dollar war on poverty even though we were already spending 40 billion.....welfare programs now take the largest portion of the federal budget, some 700 billion.The same percentage of the people today as back then are still considered poor in this country despite the trillions of dollars poured down the rathole called welfare.

2. When congress passed an inflated SS tax raising the maximum contribution from 3.2% it has ballooned to the point SS taxes exceed income taxes for about 1/2 of American workers.At one time the mamimum yearly contribution was $174.00, today there is no maximum & for most it is 10 times that.The government has expanded coverage to many groups who never paid into the system & expanded coverage/services to include social issues the system was not put into place for.The SS system is broke & headed for bankruptcy, most younger people will never get the benefits which are customary today.

3.When congress approved medicare/medicade, it lead to inflated medical expenses across the board destroying longtime private low cost insurance for many people & reducing drastically the coverage for most except for Government employees, most teacher unions & welfare recipients.The principle beneficiary of medicare/medicaid has not been the elderly, but the element of fraud & deception by those who have taken advantage of the system for personal gain. The solution?.... National Heath Care!.....DUH!!

4. We created a Federal cabinet position for education. We have spent trillions of dollars, The result?......Our children rank dead last for most academic achivement comparisons in all disciplines & for the most part are functionally illiterate upon graduation with a but a small % of exceptions.

I could go on & on, but this should qualify why government programs are a bad idea. This country was made great by the efforts of the people to work & provide for themselves with out government direction or control over what they did, how they did it or what the cost was. The great leveler was a free enterprise system which required first a need for the service or product, second quality for service or product & lastly a cost which was fair & competitive.

Government sponsered/controlled programs do not follow the above & have always vastly exceeded the cost for private enterprise, they never measure up to what is actually needed or provide the quality of the service or product as does private enterprise.

But Prosper, since you have never existed under a truely free & viable economic system, you cannot possibly know or even suspect what the advantages really are.

That's why I ask here my question, dudley. No teasing, just comparison between two economic models. We have a run for presidential elections, here in France. And there's a debate on thoses issues. And we always present america as strong libertarian model. I think it's interesting for me, a european, to know that there are those kind of debates in your country too.

Prosper - I predict that we will have a national health insurance system within the next ten years. Between what the gummint has done to drive up haelth costs and what the trial lawyers have done to drive up malpractice insurance we will have no choice. The gummint fucks sumpin' up, and then rides in on a white horse to fix it.

As P.J. O'Rpourke once said: If you think health care costs a lot now, wait until you see how much it will cost when it's free.

Denny, don't forget it's harder to equilibrate accounts when average life expectancy rises... It's a very important issue, here in France, and there's debate on how to fix this.

We would all be better off if employers did not provide insurance (universally) - if they would pass the premiums along in the form of pay to their employees and let the workers do their own shopping. I would rather see the government stipulate that people have to have health savings accounts instead. We should treat it the same as car insurance. A certain amount is mandatory, but the purchase is left up to the individual. Really, we shouldn't need insurance for anything other than catastrophic events or costly chronic ailments.

I would like to see it set up so that people would have to personally submit their bills to the insurance companies for collection. However, the consumer is removed from the insurance process by and large. For most services, for example, we don't even get an itemized statement - only the insurer sees that, and so there is no verification that the services provided were the ones that were received! That leaves lots of room for abuse of the system, which pushes up costs. This is just one problem with this set up.

However, since the government has its tendrils so entwined in our healthcare system, I only see a continued slide toward inefficient and costly socialized medicine as the outcome.

That did not come out quite the way I meant it. Employees do pay for their own health insurance, it is part of the compensation for work. However, employers manage it and so choices to the workers are limited. It would be better if the compensation were monetary, rather than in the form of pre-chosen insurance policies.

Prosper.....

I know you are not teasing,I was merely attempting to explain that which I understand to be factual. It is a shame you have never experienced a free enterprise system . It is even a bigger shame the ignorant American electorate does not understand what made this country the greatest nation in the world & allows the goverment to screw it up. Someday some historian will write a book about the former world Super Power America & pen the question....."How could so many with so much have been so stupid as to allow the Government to establish central authority over everything bringing ruin to what was once the greatest society of the world"?

Why do I feel this way? While all liberal socialist societies have failed the test of time to remain viable, no free society has .......until they turned first liberal, then socialist, then to a form of dictatorship by a central authoritative government.

It is a progression of elitism which is natural, while an avowed liberal will never admit they are truely a socialist, a socialist will always tell you they are liberal & work for the good of society. The road they travel all have the same ultimate destination ....loss of freedom & choice for the average person & control administered by the central elite. This is why my nation`s founder`s pondered whether or not the American dream would survive.

Well hell, I penned it but no one will notice & I am not qualified to write a book on the topic only opinion.......so that will be an undertaking for some future historian. Take care Prosper!

So, Prosper, it seems that most Americans think "someone else" should pay for their health care.
And this is a surprise...exactly why?
Here's my suggestion for a new poll:
"Q: Would you like the government to pay for your housing costs? Answer yes or no."
Wonder what the result of that one would be...?
I lived half my life in Canada and 9 years in Japan, so I can't be fooled about what nationalized medicine is like. I know what it's like, and I love my free market US health care. I'm fond of pointing out the fans of the Canadian system here in San Francisco that Blue Shield runs ads for health care insurance on TV up in Canada.
Think about it.

Toren et al,

You've hit the nail on the head. The distillate problem is the warm-body voting system -- one body, one vote. Although a corner stone of our (USA) past when a party/candidate promises a chicken in every pot what is the voter going to say? Hell yes, give me that chicken, I'll vote for you.

Unfortunately, solutions are controversial and unlikely to be fructified in our, or our children's, lifetimes.

The Taxman Cometh!......

I really hate this time of year ,I as usual got a late start on assembling my tax information.

1. Made sure the last estimated tax payments for the Feds & State were sent out.
2. Made sure all my 1099`s were sent out to my subcontractors.
3.First computation of Gross revenue made me wonder if I had paid in enough estimated taxes , would I have penalty payments? A healthy increase for gross income was achieved.Goody!
4.First computation of total business expense settled the tax jitters as it appears my first instinct for estimated taxes was correct.Goody!
5. The realization sank in that while gross revenue was up substantially, so was expenses with a result net actual profit was going to be down.Oh Shit!
6. Damn,Where is my Maker`s Mark & large glass when I need it? I should have bought a new truck for the writeoff & a few other things, but it`s too late now. Make that a double bourbon!
7.Double Damn,This year will be different.... Hey! thats what I said last year! On second thought make that a triple & leave the bottle on my desk!
8. Break time, let`s check out the Asshole of the week & see if Prosper & Dan S are still circling the moon. Refill! Refill! Refill!